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Analytics · Mass spectrometry · continued

Oxidation and deamidation mass shifts, tabulated posts 31–60

This is a continuation of a long topic, addressed by post number rather than by page. Start at post 1 · go to the accepted answer.

BO
b.okonkwoTL25 Jan 2025#31
FF
f.fonsecaTL27 Jan 2025#32

Oxidation adds sixteen per oxygen and is the most common modification seen in aged material. Its presence in the spectrum is informative about handling as well as synthesis.

0 likes 19mo
HS
hana.satoTL4 Moderator9 Jan 2025#33
g.tanaka, post #14: Building on post #13 rather than restating it. Combining a chromatographic result with a mass result is genuinely orthogonal confirmation. Either alone leaves a specific class of problem invisible, and the two classes do not overlap much. Worth reading the earlier posts in this thread before acting on mine. Go to post

Where I part company with post #32, and it is a narrow parting.

Response in electrospray is not proportional to abundance across different species. Using peak intensities from a mass spectrum to estimate proportions is a mistake that looks reasonable.

28 likes in reply to #14 19mo
AA
a.aguirreTL211 Jan 2025#34

Post #32 is the version of this I will quote in future. One addition.

Where I would push back on the oxidation and deamidation mass shifts consensus is the confidence, not the direction. The direction looks right. The confidence is borrowed.

14 likes 19mo
PI
p.iyer_pharmdTL3Pharmacist12 Jan 2025#35

For a compound with no reference standard in circulation, an observed mass is much more useful than an assertion of agreement with a theoretical value nobody can check.

8 likes 18mo
NO
n.okwuosaTL214 Jan 2025#36

Picking up post #35: that is the part I would want checked first.

An acylated peptide has a mass that reflects the modification, so comparing against the mass of the unmodified backbone gives a mismatch that is not an error.

2 likes 18mo
SS
system_suitabilityTL3Analytical chemist16 Jan 2025#37
i.amankwah, post #19: Coming back to post #17, because the follow-up matters more than the original answer. Calibration matters: a high-resolution instrument out of calibration can report mass with ppm error large enough to be uninformative. Check when the instrument was last calibrated before trusting the reported accuracy. For what it is worth, the same… Go to post

I had written a reply contradicting post #35 and deleted it. Here is what survived.

Resolution: "high resolution" commonly means <5 ppm across the mass range. Unit-resolution instruments achieve ±1 Da at best and cannot distinguish two species differing by less than 1 Da in total mass.

I have deliberately not rounded that, because the rounding is where the argument starts.

0 likes in reply to #19 18mo
HI
h.iyerTL218 Jan 2025 · edited#38
m.ilunga, post #11: Everything in post #9 holds. The case it does not cover is the one I have. For a compound with no reference standard in circulation, an observed mass is much more useful than an assertion of agreement with a theoretical value nobody can check. Go to post

Adding a data point of agreement rather than a data point.

19 likes in reply to #11 18mo
NN
n.nakamuraTL220 Jan 2025#39

Worth separating two things that post #35 runs together.

Purity and identity are different questions: LC-MS establishes that the species at a retention time has the expected mass. It does not establish how much of the sample is that species (that is what LC-UV purity answers).

This is the sort of thing that ought to be settled and apparently is not.

13 likes 18mo
J
JFitzgibbonTL221 Jan 2025#40
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outline_firstTL3Wiki editor23 Jan 2025#41

This is the sort of exchange that makes the archive worth searching.

0 likes 18mo
GA
g.amankwahTL225 Jan 2025 · edited#42

I had written a reply contradicting post #39 and deleted it. Here is what survived.

What mass accuracy establishes: the measured mass is consistent with a specific composition. What it does not establish: purity, sequence order, stereochemistry, or the absence of an isobaric species. Every one of those requires something else.

Filing this under things that are true until someone shows me otherwise.

0 likes 18mo
CT
cannula_traceTL3Regular26 Jan 2025#43
m.ilunga, post #11: Everything in post #9 holds. The case it does not cover is the one I have. For a compound with no reference standard in circulation, an observed mass is much more useful than an assertion of agreement with a theoretical value nobody can check. Go to post

Common adducts: sodium adds ≈22, potassium adds ≈38 compared to hydrogen. A [M+Na]+ peak is common and its mass is predictable from the base mass.

4 likes in reply to #11 18mo
VR
v.rautioTL228 Jan 2025#44
so.mbeki, post #21: Understood. Thank you for being specific about the limits of it. Go to post

Calibration matters: a high-resolution instrument out of calibration can report mass with ppm error large enough to be uninformative. Check when the instrument was last calibrated before trusting the reported accuracy.

12 likes in reply to #21 18mo
SS
steady_stateTL330 Jan 2025#45
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s.vukovicTL21 Feb 2025#46

Coming back to post #42, because the follow-up matters more than the original answer.

Combining a chromatographic result with a mass result is genuinely orthogonal confirmation. Either alone leaves a specific class of problem invisible, and the two classes do not overlap much.

1 like 18mo
SB
sharps_binTL2Regular2 Feb 2025#47
s.teixeira, post #17: Mass accuracy is expressed in parts per million. It is the difference between observed and theoretical mass divided by theoretical mass, multiplied by a million. A high-resolution instrument in good calibration achieves low single-digit ppm on a peptide of this size. I would not lead a decision with this, but I would not ignore it either. Go to post

Trifluoroacetate adducts are common in material purified with TFA and are one reason a mass spectrum from a peptide can look busier than expected.

Two people can read the same figure differently here and both be reasonable.

7 likes in reply to #17 18mo
SO
se.okaforTL24 Feb 2025#48

The honest summary of what a mass result buys you: it narrows the field of what the material could be, considerably. It never closes it, and no certificate should be read as though it had.

Noting that the question and the thing people usually mean by it are different.

17 likes 18mo
DH
dietitian_hollisTL3Dietitian6 Feb 2025 · edited#49

Resolution and mass accuracy are different specifications. An instrument can resolve two species and still assign their masses imprecisely, and the reverse is also possible.

0 likes 18mo
BK
b.kowalskiTL27 Feb 2025#50

Reading back through, this was answered upthread and I missed it. My fault.

3 likes 18mo
RB
r.bakkenTL29 Feb 2025#51

Mass error in parts per million is (observed minus theoretical) divided by theoretical, times a million. On a high-resolution instrument a low single-digit figure is unremarkable and expected.

Take it as a starting point and not as a specification.

24 likes 18mo
CW
c.wijnbergTL2Member11 Feb 2025#52

A mass match establishes that the measured mass is consistent with the proposed composition. It does not establish purity, sequence order, or the absence of an isomer, and all three are frequently claimed from it.

Someone should write this up properly, and it should probably not be me.

11 likes 18mo
EF
e.ferreiraTL3Regular12 Feb 2025#53

Following, with nothing to contribute beyond having asked the same thing elsewhere.

3 likes 17mo
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KAnderssonTL3Regular14 Feb 2025 · edited#54
a.finnegan_rd, post #1: Posting this under the heading it deserves: Oxidation and deamidation mass shifts, tabulated Everything below is what sits behind that. Oxidation and deamidation mass shifts, and specifically the version of it that the documentation does not cover. The maintained page handles the general case well and stops exactly where my question… Go to post

Monoisotopic and average mass are different numbers and both appear on documents. At this molecular weight the difference is a few daltons, which is more than the tolerance being claimed.

0 likes in reply to #1 17mo
JR
j.restrepoTL216 Feb 2025#55

Tandem mass spectrometry with fragmentation gives sequence information that intact mass cannot. It is the analysis that would actually confirm identity, and it is rarely supplied.

I keep a log of this specifically because memory is unreliable about it.

32 likes 17mo
DS
d.szymanskiTL3Wiki editor17 Feb 2025#56

Mass accuracy is expressed in parts per million. It is the difference between observed and theoretical mass divided by theoretical mass, multiplied by a million. A high-resolution instrument in good calibration achieves low single-digit ppm on a peptide of this size.

If anyone has run this properly I would rather read that than my own guess.

16 likes 17mo
SZ
s.zamoraTL219 Feb 2025#57
j.vandermolen, post #20: Appreciated. The plain phrasing does more work here than a longer post would. Go to post

Worth separating two things that post #54 runs together.

Adducts — sodium and potassium especially — shift the observed mass in predictable increments. A report showing an unexplained plus twenty-two is usually showing you a sodium adduct.

6 likes in reply to #20 17mo
BW
bac_waterTL2Regular20 Feb 2025#58
a.eriksen, post #7: Resolution and mass accuracy are different specifications. An instrument can resolve two species and still assign their masses imprecisely, and the reverse is also possible. Happy to be corrected if someone holds better data than mine. Go to post

Reporting rather than recommending, on oxidation and deamidation mass shifts. What happened is above. Whether it should have is a different question and not one I am qualified to answer.

1 like in reply to #7 17mo
IG
i.guerreroTL222 Feb 2025#59

Answering the question post #57 raises rather than the one it answers.

Deamidation adds approximately one dalton and produces a species that frequently elutes very close to the parent. It is the hardest common impurity to see chromatographically and the easiest to see by mass.

The short answer was in the first line; everything after is the working.

0 likes 17mo
TD
titration_diaryTL3Regular24 Feb 2025#60

Summarising the oxidation and deamidation mass shifts thread so far, since it is long and the answer is buried: the first reply has the method, the fourth has the correction to it, and the rest is people agreeing at length.

23 likes 17mo