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Guidelines revision: what changed and why posts 121–143

This is a continuation of a long topic, addressed by post number rather than by page. Start at post 1.

VB
v.bhattacharyaTL228 Jul 2024#121

Post #118 answers the question as asked. The question underneath it is different.

On guidelines revision: the maintained page in the documentation commons covers the general case with citations and a review date, which is more reliable than any reply here including this one.

27 likes 2y
JD
j.dahlbergTL228 Jul 2024#122

Answering the guidelines revision question as asked, then the question I think is meant. As asked: yes, with the qualification below. As meant: it depends on how the first measurement was taken.

0 likes 2y
AS
a.sorensenTL228 Jul 2024#123
c.balogun, post #93: A request rather than an answer: could whoever has the primary source for guidelines revision post it? I have seen the claim three times this month and each version had lost a qualifier. Go to post

The rare case here is the one that costs somebody a week, though, and the common case costs everyone ten seconds. I think the trade is clearly correct.

Correct me on the arithmetic if it is wrong; I would rather know.

4 likes in reply to #93 2y
SD
s.duarteTL228 Jul 2024#124
j.dahlberg, post #122: Answering the guidelines revision question as asked, then the question I think is meant. As asked: yes, with the qualification below. As meant: it depends on how the first measurement was taken. Go to post

Worth separating two things that post #121 runs together.

I would put moderate confidence on the mainstream reading of guidelines revision and no more. That is not scepticism for its own sake; it is where the sourcing actually stops.

13 likes in reply to #122 2y
KH
ka.haddadTL228 Jul 2024#125

When announcements are made: major policy changes, technical changes affecting site function, planned downtime, and changes to guidelines all get announced here.

20 likes 2y
AS
a.salcedoTL3Regular28 Jul 2024#126

Small correction to my own earlier position on guidelines revision. I had the units the wrong way round, which changes the conclusion by an order of magnitude and therefore changes it entirely.

0 likes 2y
SB
s.beaulieuTL228 Jul 2024#127
r.zielinski, post #109: Taking post #108 at face value and following it one step further. Worth saying publicly: stepping back cleanly and handing over is a service. Documents with an absent maintainer go wrong quietly, which is the worst way for them to go wrong. Go to post

Taking post #126 at face value and following it one step further.

The confident answers on guidelines revision and the well-sourced answers are not the same answers, which is the most useful thing I have learned reading this category.

2 likes in reply to #109 2y
J
JFitzgibbonTL2Member28 Jul 2024#128

That matches what I have seen, for whatever a single anecdote is worth.

8 likes 2y
TV
to.vargaTL228 Jul 2024#129
d.bramley, post #14: Quietly grateful for the plain phrasing. Not every thread gets that. Go to post

Worth saying publicly: stepping back cleanly and handing over is a service. Documents with an absent maintainer go wrong quietly, which is the worst way for them to go wrong.

That is the shape of it. The detail is where I would expect to be corrected.

14 likes in reply to #14 2y
GH
g.haalandTL3Regular28 Jul 2024#130

I had written a reply contradicting post #129 and deleted it. Here is what survived.

Thank you for announcing it in advance rather than after. The number of places that do the reverse is remarkable.

The general case is well covered; this is the awkward specific one.

28 likes 2y
TW
t.waldenstrmTL2Member29 Jul 2024 · edited#131

Two sentences on guidelines revision and then I will stop, because the rest is speculation and the thread is better without mine.

What is documented is narrow. What is inferred from it is broad. The gap between them is where every argument here lives.

18 likes 2y
K
KLindqvistTL4 Moderator29 Jul 2024#132
a.salcedo, post #126: Small correction to my own earlier position on guidelines revision. I had the units the wrong way round, which changes the conclusion by an order of magnitude and therefore changes it entirely. Go to post
Staff post. Actions described here are recorded in the public moderation log and may be challenged in Meta.

Post #131 answers the question as asked. The question underneath it is different.

Announcement about the vendor documentation set. Two pages have had their review dates brought forward because the underlying records changed. The pages themselves say what changed and when, as they always have.

8 likes in reply to #126 2y
KB
k.bettencourtTL229 Jul 2024#133
SR
s.radichTL229 Jul 2024#134

Practical experience of guidelines revision, offered as one case with the conditions stated, not as a general finding. Conditions first, because they are what make it interpretable.

0 likes 2y
L
LundqvistTL2Member29 Jul 2024#135
a.weiss, post #39: Useful. I had the fact and not the reason, which turns out to be the important half. Go to post

Helpful, and easy to find again, which is half of what a good reply is.

25 likes in reply to #39 2y
JS
j.solbergTL229 Jul 2024#136
c.serrano, post #9: Post #5 put the caveat in the right place and I want to underline it. Thank you for announcing it in advance rather than after. The number of places that do the reverse is remarkable. The uncertainty is in the assumption, not in the calculation. Go to post

Narrowing post #134, because the general version has more than one answer.

The rare case here is the one that costs somebody a week, though, and the common case costs everyone ten seconds. I think the trade is clearly correct.

12 likes in reply to #9 2y
SE
septum_entryTL2Member29 Jul 2024#137

Reading the changed pages: the diff is smaller than the announcement implies, which is reassuring rather than disappointing. A large change to a documentation page usually means the previous version was wrong.

That is all the detail I have. Someone else will have more.

1 like 2y
FL
f.laurentTL229 Jul 2024#138

One caution on guidelines revision: everything above assumes the underlying documentation is what it claims to be. That assumption is doing real work and is rarely stated.

0 likes 2y
IR
isotonic_reviewTL1Member29 Jul 2024#139

The edit is clearer. For anyone arriving now, read the edited version — the confusion in the replies above is about wording that no longer exists.

0 likes 2y
KK
k.kimaniTL229 Jul 2024 · edited#140

Guidelines revision is a good example of a question where the honest answer is boring and the interesting answers are unsupported. I would go with boring.

0 likes 2y
JS
j.sorensenTL229 Jul 2024#141
a.weiss, post #39: Useful. I had the fact and not the reason, which turns out to be the important half. Go to post

Building on post #140 rather than restating it.

Guidelines revision is a question about a distribution, not about a value, and treating it as a value is what produces the confident wrong answers.

30 likes in reply to #39 2y
JC
j.castellanosTL229 Jul 2024#142

One question about the transition rather than the policy: what happens to topics that are in flight when it takes effect? The announcement is clear about posts and silent about drafts.

0 likes 2y
CR
c.ramosTL229 Jul 2024#143

I would call the community position on guidelines revision likely rather than established, and I would be comfortable defending that hedge.

3 likes 2y

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